|
|
| |
Forum Overview
::
Motherfucking News
|
| |
|
by ndd 12/24/2011, 8:46am PST |
|
 |
|
 |
|
Mischief Maker wrote:
ndd wrote:
i just don't get why you are still so dishonest about what you're interested in and why. religion and society matter to you. you have serious thoughts and questions about them. you're not just dicking around with this shit because LOL CALTROPS - that's a lame excuse and i think even you know it.
what is your actual interest? you can tell me, i'm not going to laugh at you. caltrops isn't going to die due to an excess of sharing.
Only dishonest in my intentions. Everything I've posted on Caltrops is consistent with my personal philosophy, I've just been doling it out in small, out-of-context chunks that avoid spelling out the overriding theme for 3 reasons:
1. I don't want to pull a Quentinbec and give enough identifying info here that the antics of my electronic persona begin to interfere with the life of my meat persona.
2. Defining my actual interest is still very much a work in progress and when I've tried to express it in its incomplete form to people IRL, it's often completely misinterpreted. Lord knows how it would fly in cyberspace.
3. {Ed. Note: fucking youtube clip retracted}
So you're paranoid, risk-averse, and more than willing to let other people speak for you.
B|
But for you, my dear, anything.
Ever since my young adulthood, I have been troubled by people/society's tendency to value imaginary/conceptual things over real/material things, and their protection of such dysfunctional beliefs by granting them sacred/serious status. Religion is merely the most obvious example of this phenomenon, and as such I attack it with gusto.
/rekkidneedlescratch.mp3
You're a lawyer. You truck entirely in the conceptual over the material! You must mean something else here, something like - "imaginary things that provide no benefit to anyone" or.... fuck man I don't even know. Do you have any idea how derailed I am right now!
To address uwpp's previous ruminations, my disdain for religion is not the result of being "Mr Rebound" for churchy chicks in High School. That was actually pretty awesome, if confusing. If you want a formative trauma from that time that shaped the trajectory of my life, it would probably be writing for the high school newspaper. I did not submit a single article that was not censored in one form or another. Tellingly, it was not my dirty jokes that were cut, but my criticisms of the school administration's policies. I guess I've now answered my own question of why I've stuck with the 'Trops through thick and thin.
There's shit missing from the middle of all these thoughts. "I was censored, thus disdain for religion." I mean I understand you were saying earlier about conceptual vs. material and I can sort of see, maybe, "I was censored by an authority in a way which reduced my autonomy and expression while providing nothing worth having either to me or others, and I think Religion as a whole operates in kind, thus disdain for religion."
But I had to make that up, that stuff in italics. I don't know if that's what you actually think or not.
The philosophy of Science was obviously very appealing, but I soon learned in college that lab work was not fulfilling to me, didn't play to my natural talents, and with Bush and the Republicans buddying up to the creationists and putting stem cell research under the crosshairs at the time, didn't seem like a secure career choice. Nonetheless, I still identify much more as a scientist than as a lawyer.
...ma...material...conceptual... imma hit some stack overflow shit in a minute here.
This is why I found your idea to become a preacher so awful. Even a "live and let live" noncommittal left-leaning religion like Unitarianism. If anything, its refusal to scrutinize the validity of any religion's "sacred" values is anathema to me.
But then we went through and scrutinized the shit out of my beliefs - all the way down to the nitty gritty! - and it was fine. Granted, I was left with a completely unchanged mind, though also a lot of new granularity, but I would think you'd have come away from that discussion with the idea of "not all religious people are blindly religious." And instead you seemed to come away with "zsensy is not religious."
I tried to point out at the time that your adherence to your unpleasant definition of "religious" was... curiously... zealous... but, you know, feelings, running high, all of that.
There are people who shut their eyes and adhere completely to what they are told when it is labelled a certain way, and those people will be zealots for whatever they are going to zealot for - Republicanism, Jainism, Dragonball Z (I'm being serious here, I think fandom behavior is very close to religious behavior), whatever. People who are going to do it will do it for something. I think it lacks both respect and accuracy to lump into this body the Thomas Beckets or Mahatma Ghandis or Constantines or Nantembos of the world, or even the petty boojoys Zsensies of the world, or even the regular folks who believe this or that, and even go to church or temple or whatever of a weekend, but otherwise Do Not Care.
I feel that your beef with religion has quite a lot to do with the hamfisted, power-tripping, willfully-blind Christian right wing which has worked hard to make everyone's life more difficult and everyone's arguments less sensible over the last 30 years: the worst of religion married to political and social momentum. But for whatever reason you want to name ALL OF RELIGION your conceptual enemy rather than concentrating on stupidest-religion+political-power, and as a consequence it is necessary for you to build this false equivalency: all religions are like that religion, all religious people are like those religious people. tldr what you are mad about is propaganda, but your response has a sort of propaganda-ish savor about it.
But truth be told, scary as religious folks are getting these days, I think the more pernicious influences over the world today are "unquestionable" secular values.
I am having so much trouble dancing from your opening line to these little philosophical etudes.
For the specific topic that's been on my mind these last few months, I'm still mulling over "The Great Happiness Space." I saw the prostitutes and hostesses willfully letting themselves be victimized by the same racket they profit from not as a freakshow of crazy Japanese subcultures, but as an example of a desperate longing that everyone in our society attempts to satisfy with imperfect substitutes (religion being one of them,) amplified by these people living at the outermost edges. But to satisfy that longing? That would require slaughtering one of the most sacred cows of civilized society...
Why on earth are you pulling this punch?!?!?!? Are you trying to frustrate me?! Remember, I'm not that smart! So I can't even imagine what this sacred cow would be. Is it monogamy, haltering the Natural Human Urge To Have Casual Sex And Loving Relationships With Lots And Lots Of People? I'm only guessing that because I remember you talking about Sex At Dawn before (remind me to tell you my wonderfully self-indulgent new theory about the purposes of men and women.)
At the same time I'm in a career shift from Lawyer to full-time Mediator. The more I learn and the more cases I mediate pro bono, the more I'm amazed and appalled at the waste caused by deferred conflicts and people overvaluing their dysfunctional beliefs. This is a job I'm hoping will truly satisfy my personal values.
And best wishes and hopes for that. But also - if not this conflict, if not this waste, then what?
I mean - what do you think (or is "believe" a better word?) humanity would be doing if not this? I wonder if you don't have a vision of optimization which is frustrated by actual human nature. Not that that's a crime or anything, but - if not waste, then what would be happening?
Does that answer your question?
NO, IT ONLY GETS ANNOYINGLY CLOSE AND THEN FLUTTERS AWAY INTO THE NIGHT AGAIN.
MERRY FUCKING CHRISTMAS |
|
 |
|
 |
|
|
|
| |
Hitchens is in a pretty awkward conversation with Mother Teresa and Jesus Christ NT by Fullofkitttens 12/16/2011, 8:44am PST 
Oh really? A woman who adored suffering and pain, and a mythical figure NT by Tansin A. Darcos (TDARCOS) 12/17/2011, 10:44am PST 
Okay NT by Fag 12/17/2011, 5:52pm PST 
Jesus Christ was a person who existed for real, FYI NT by Contaminated H202 12/18/2011, 12:57am PST 
And you have proof of this, from? by Tansin A. Darcos (TDARCOS) 12/18/2011, 7:55am PST 
Jesus is frowning at you so hard from Heaven NT by Entropy Stew 12/18/2011, 5:48pm PST 
Jesus will forgive Tdarcos just as he forgave Christopher Hitchens. ^__^ <3 NT by Fullofkittens 12/18/2011, 6:19pm PST 
There are other references to this guy. by laudablepuss 12/18/2011, 11:46pm PST 
Hitchens Agreed! by Mischief Maker 12/19/2011, 8:20am PST 
Isn't it more about there being Christians in 60 AD? by Worm 12/19/2011, 11:56am PST 
Re: Isn't it more about there being Christians in 60 AD? by laudablepuss 12/19/2011, 1:05pm PST 
Well his complaint was the bible was 100 years after the fact and you go by hey here's something 60 years after 12/19/2011, 1:35pm PST 
I can't take this complaint seriously. by laudablepuss 12/19/2011, 10:48pm PST 
What other complaint could anyone have really? by Worm 12/20/2011, 12:29am PST 
How can you justify to a peasant that they suffer and die for your benefit? by Mischief Maker 12/19/2011, 2:26pm PST 
Re: How can you justify to a peasant that they suffer and die for your benefit? by laudablepuss 12/19/2011, 11:23pm PST 
Re: How can you justify to a peasant that they suffer and die for your benefit? by Roop 12/20/2011, 1:59am PST 
oh my god if i wasn't totally slammed i would spend an hour setting all of this by straight -ndd 12/20/2011, 5:28am PST 
Whatever but think of a punchline next time NT by Roop 12/20/2011, 6:30am PST 
Nice "space reserved" reply by laudablepuss 12/20/2011, 8:11am PST 
Let me tell you about a "cool dude" his name was Jesus. by Worm 12/20/2011, 10:36am PST 
Re: Let me tell you about a "cool dude" his name was Jesus. by laudablepuss 12/20/2011, 11:09am PST 
I dunno is it more proof than a religious text dedicated to worshiping him and by Worm 12/20/2011, 11:39am PST 
*pythagrites NT by Worm 12/20/2011, 11:42am PST 
Nope. by laudablepuss 12/20/2011, 12:48pm PST 
This is gold, btw by laudablepuss 12/20/2011, 12:55pm PST 
"tenants" of a religion by up with pod people 12/20/2011, 1:08pm PST 
Dude, I called my Lord to tell him about the pedophile infestation... by Religion Tenant 12/20/2011, 1:49pm PST 
Words . . . uh huh huh . . . words . . . by laudablepuss 12/20/2011, 2:13pm PST 
Yes the words "Christ existed" lend like zero validity to Christianity. by Worm 12/20/2011, 3:51pm PST 
Re: Yes the words "Christ existed" lend like zero validity to Christianity. by laudablepuss 12/20/2011, 4:40pm PST 
My taxes pay for your booze, goddamn lazy civil servants! by Mischief Maker 12/20/2011, 8:32am PST 
Have you ever made a legal argument out of Youtube clips? NT by Mysterio 12/20/2011, 11:40am PST 
Okay, I'll bite. Why the pathological hatred of lawyers, anonyfag? NT by Mischief Maker 12/20/2011, 11:46am PST 
Is there a single person who doesn't hate lawyers? Is that person a lawyer? NT by different anonyfag 12/20/2011, 1:21pm PST 
Lots of them, they're called people in trouble. You may become one someday. NT by Mischief Maker 12/20/2011, 1:46pm PST 
I'm going to guess "TV writers" as one group that loves lawyers by laudablepuss 12/20/2011, 2:23pm PST 
I don't hate lawyers and I never have by jeep 12/22/2011, 4:30pm PST 
Why the insistence that everyone hates everything BUT your lazy youtube linking? NT by Mysterio 12/20/2011, 4:20pm PST 
Palpatine? Is that you? by Mischief Plinkett 12/20/2011, 6:01pm PST 
No. by ndd 12/21/2011, 9:43pm PST 
Re: No. by Souffle of Pain 12/21/2011, 10:48pm PST 
awww souffle what a sweetiepants by ndd 12/23/2011, 11:29am PST 
Re: awww souffle what a sweetiepants by Souffle of Pain 12/23/2011, 3:04pm PST 
Re: awww souffle what a sweetiepants by ndd 12/23/2011, 4:29pm PST 
Re: No. by Mischief Maker 12/21/2011, 10:51pm PST 
I have something profound to say about Christ by Ice Cream Jonsey 12/22/2011, 4:03pm PST 
Re: No. by ndd 12/23/2011, 11:31am PST 
Re: No. by Mischief Maker 12/23/2011, 7:38pm PST 
Re: No. by ndd 12/24/2011, 8:46am PST 
Re: No. by Mischief Maker 12/24/2011, 11:01am PST 
See? Much better by Mysterio 12/24/2011, 2:00pm PST 
I like that you're expounding on forum etiquette no-nos as a Mysterio. by Mischief Maker 12/24/2011, 3:37pm PST 
That didn't last long. You're back in the slump. by Mysterio 12/24/2011, 10:42pm PST 
are you trying to fix this guy or what by Mysterio 12/25/2011, 8:17am PST 
Re: are you trying to fix this guy or what by Mysterio 12/25/2011, 9:23am PST 
Long live the new flesh! by Mischief Maker 12/25/2011, 11:13am PST 
Perhaps I should make myself more clear. by Mischief Maker 12/25/2011, 12:03pm PST 
Re: Perhaps I should make myself more clear. by Mysterio 12/25/2011, 2:34pm PST 
Behold, Zseni, my enemy in secular form. by Mischief Maker 12/27/2011, 6:35pm PST 
no. by ndd 12/29/2011, 6:41am PST 
Re: no. by Last 12/29/2011, 8:56am PST 
Re: no. by ndd 01/01/2012, 9:22pm PST 
What a fool I've been! Zseni, you've shown me the error of my ways. by Mischief Maker 01/02/2012, 8:51am PST 
Re: What a fool I've been! Zseni, you've shown me the error of my ways. by laudablepuss 01/02/2012, 7:24pm PST 
I'm going to assume that this is not representative of your professional behavio by ndd 12/24/2011, 2:41pm PST 
Defensible things don't NEED to be sacred! NT by Mischief Maker 12/24/2011, 3:40pm PST 
What does sacred even mean to you? NT by Gutsby 12/24/2011, 8:14pm PST 
shit you don't criticize because YOU DON'T CRITICIZE NT by not misceif maker 12/24/2011, 9:09pm PST 
yeah but that definition falls apart if a dude cannot think of the words by ndd 12/24/2011, 9:19pm PST 
I get it. by Mischief Maker 12/24/2011, 11:14pm PST 
WHY ARE YOU WORKING BACKWARDS THROUGH ALL OF THE MOST AWFUL IDEAS by ndd 12/24/2011, 11:34pm PST 
if i do, they need to be identified and eliminated by not misceif maker 12/24/2011, 7:08pm PST 
Re: No. by Mysterio 12/23/2011, 11:36am PST 
Re: No. by laudablepuss 12/22/2011, 1:33pm PST 
Re: No. by ndd 12/23/2011, 11:35am PST 
I just deny Christ historic or otherwise on principle. by Worm 12/22/2011, 3:59pm PST 
btw btw i got some shit to say about the laziness of civil servants by ndd 12/21/2011, 9:44pm PST 
Re: btw btw i got some shit to say about the laziness of civil servants by Arbit 12/22/2011, 3:02pm PST 
When I die and go to Hell... by FoK 12/22/2011, 4:04pm PST 
Re: When I die and go to Hell... by Mysterio 12/23/2011, 11:06am PST 
sorry that was me. i'm really tired. :( NT by ndd 12/23/2011, 11:19am PST 
quadratic time complexity by Entropy Stew 12/24/2011, 9:52pm PST 
Holy shit, I wrote this? by laudablepuss 03/24/2014, 12:56pm PDT 
I think I want to keep some insults I threw at Worm though. by laudablepuss 03/24/2014, 1:17pm PDT 
Jesus still is only about as historically verified as Thor. NT by Worm 03/24/2014, 4:56pm PDT 
Believe whatever mofucking shit you want to believe in you mofucker NT by But believe in something, mofucker 03/24/2014, 7:51pm PDT 
No, this isn't true. This isn't true at all. NT by John Gulp 03/24/2014, 10:15pm PDT 
Sure it is, when we use the "Historical Jesus" standard for truth. NT by Worm 03/24/2014, 10:27pm PDT 
I thought his Crucifixion was verifiable. by John Gulp 03/24/2014, 10:38pm PDT 
The crucifixion is entirely drawn from Psalms and other sources by laudablepuss 03/26/2014, 10:05am PDT 
So I don't understand by John Gulp 03/26/2014, 11:56am PDT 
Worm was saying that, Tdarcos was saying that by laudablepuss 03/26/2014, 1:07pm PDT 
Jesus is hogging this thread by Mischief Maker 12/20/2011, 9:06am PST 
|
|
| |
|
| |