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Re: Here is why Nemesis sucked: an opinion by laudablepuss 10/16/2008, 4:14pm PDT
Ice Cream Jonsey wrote:

1. Horrible attempt to capture the "magic" of WoK


No idea what you're talking about here. I'm sure you don't have any idea either.

2. Horrible, mealy-mouthed ending for Data, who is probably the third best-developed character in the franchise, after Spock and Picard


This is your main problem, I'm sure. This is everyone's main problem with the movie. I agree, it wasn't done well. But!

3. Data's end is reported to in part be due to Spiner feeling he is too old to play the part, while we live in a world where every character a six-year old version of me would want to see in a movie (Hulk, Spider-Man, Iron Man, the monster from Brotherhood of the Wolf)(the six-year old version of me was all about French whores and karate) has been CGI at some point


Androids aren't supposed to get all flabby with double chins. I can see Spiner's point here. Big flaw in a character that isn't supposed to ever age, although I suppose an artificial aging mechanism could be invented for him. Seems like a stretch. But I agree, it still sucks.

4. The actual nemesis of the movie was the kind of fag you wouldn't even apologize to if you made him spill his own drink at a bar, because honestly, he was probably sipping mineral water


Bear in mind that Picard is a smallish French man who nevertheless is one of the most respected, even feared, starfleet captains in history. The hope was that the clone would benefit from the years Patrick Stewart and the writers have worked to make his character formidable. It obviously didn't work for you, but I'm not convinced the idea was a bad one. Especially since it did work for me.

5. Picard had a full head of hair when he was younger, Picard had an artificial heart that made one line of dialogue retarded, I mean, no, it doesn't really matter, but Jesus Christ, I should never know more than the screenwriter


Nitpicky, but a good point. I had managed to forget all about that part of Picard's character. But let's talk about the screenwriter for the perfect-in every-way WoK: we suddenly have a Klingon neutral zone! Right where we'd already established the Romulan neutral zone was! It's a tube! Klingons suddenly don't take prisoners! Talk about changed premises.

6. A 90 minute movie somehow gives most of the cast less to do than the typical hour's episode

7. I really can't fully describe how shitty the entire conflict in this movie was represented - it doesn't lend itself towards a pithy list, but good grief


I thought Data's explanation of the conflict in Stellar Cartography was one of the best scenes in the movie. It sounds bad that a character explained the conflict I suppose, but it worked for me.

8. Everything involving "B4".

9. It completely killed off any chance of Stewart, who is awesome, ever being in another Trek flick.


I won't put the sex scene with Troi in the list, because the older she is, the better chance I have, and I don't need her printing out my fucking Caltrops posts and confronting me with them when she has sensed a great longing and anger in my etc.

The good part in Nemesis was Picard saying "on screen" when the entire front of the Enterprise had been smashed away. Anyone can play Hamlet, but making that line and grimace that follows works takes talent. I'll also say that in 20 years, Insurrection will be viewed in the same was a TMP is, where nobody can understand why caused so much piss to be sprayed when he debuted.


the dark and gritty...Ice Cream Jonsey!


It's true that this movie appears to have killed off TNG movies forever. And that sucks a lot. But I'm really at a loss to pinpoint anything about this movie that was so terrible, except for the way Data was killed off. With no prospect of a "The Search for Data" movie, it's not a good way to end things.
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I personally guarantee the new Star Trek will be awesome. by Last 10/16/2008, 9:27am PDT NEW
    what's the enterprise doing with a NT by steve jobs looking character? 10/16/2008, 12:22pm PDT NEW
        That's Captain Kirk, he captains the ship. by Last 10/16/2008, 12:46pm PDT NEW
            And you know a Star Trek move that features Kirk Mountainclimbing has to be good NT by Mischief Maker 10/16/2008, 12:49pm PDT NEW
    You're being sarcastic, right? by Mischief Maker 10/16/2008, 12:47pm PDT NEW
    Handheld cam shots of hip suburban Kirk and Spock talking about their favorite b by Creexuls, a monster >:3 10/16/2008, 1:12pm PDT NEW
        Re: Handheld cam shots of hip suburban Kirk and Spock talking about their favori by Last 10/16/2008, 1:24pm PDT NEW
            Because they are about the movie? NT by Creexuls, a monster >:3 10/16/2008, 2:31pm PDT NEW
            heh. . . Sulu NT by swallow. . . heh 10/17/2008, 3:44pm PDT NEW
    I will guarantee Last's guarantee by Ice Cream Jonsey 10/16/2008, 1:33pm PDT NEW
        Re: I will guarantee Last's guarantee by laudablepuss 10/16/2008, 2:20pm PDT NEW
            Nemsis was without any merit by FABIO 10/16/2008, 3:07pm PDT NEW
                I'm aware of your (wrong) opinion. NT by laudablepuss 10/16/2008, 3:13pm PDT NEW
            Here is why Nemesis sucked: an opinion by Ice Cream Jonsey 10/16/2008, 3:30pm PDT NEW
                Also, to calibrate by Ice Cream Jonsey 10/16/2008, 3:31pm PDT NEW
                Wasn't there a scene where Picard and them were stealing the dunebuggy... by Last 10/16/2008, 4:05pm PDT NEW
                Re: Here is why Nemesis sucked: an opinion by laudablepuss 10/16/2008, 4:14pm PDT NEW
                    Re: Here is why Nemesis sucked: an opinion by Creexuls, a monster >:3 10/16/2008, 4:17pm PDT NEW
                        Re: Here is why Nemesis sucked: an opinion by laudablepuss 10/16/2008, 4:19pm PDT NEW
                            The Enterprise is almost totally destroyed and a main character sacrifices thems by Creexuls, a monster >:3 10/16/2008, 5:36pm PDT NEW
                                Actually perhaps they ARE very different movies. by Creexuls, a monster >:3 10/16/2008, 5:47pm PDT NEW
                                    Re: Actually perhaps they ARE very different movies. by laudablepuss 10/16/2008, 5:55pm PDT NEW
                                        Re: Actually perhaps they ARE very different movies. by Creexuls, a monster >:3 10/16/2008, 6:35pm PDT NEW
                                            Re: Actually perhaps they ARE very different movies. by laudablepuss 10/16/2008, 7:08pm PDT NEW
                                                Judging by your post here, if you liked Nemesis, you'll love Voyager. by Creexuls, a monster >:3 10/16/2008, 7:23pm PDT NEW
                                                    Here's a Star Trek episode that laudablepuss thinks is really great. by Creexuls, a monster >:3 10/16/2008, 7:27pm PDT NEW
                                                        That's the victory bell ringing. Thanks, it was fun. NT by laudablepuss 10/16/2008, 7:32pm PDT NEW
                                                            So you actually liked that episode? No wonder you don't understand why Nemesis s NT by Creexuls, a monster >:3 10/16/2008, 7:37pm PDT NEW
                                                    Re: Judging by your post here, if you liked Nemesis, you'll love Voyager. by laudablepuss 10/16/2008, 7:31pm PDT NEW
                                                        Re: Judging by your post here, if you liked Nemesis, you'll love Voyager. by Creexuls, a monster >:3 10/16/2008, 7:37pm PDT NEW
                                                            Thought you could slip this in there, huh? by laudablepuss 10/16/2008, 9:18pm PDT NEW
                                                                Re: Thought you could slip this in there, huh? by Creexuls, a monster >:3 10/16/2008, 9:33pm PDT NEW
                                                                    Re: Thought you could slip this in there, huh? by laudablepuss 10/16/2008, 10:02pm PDT NEW
                                                                        Re: Thought you could slip this in there, huh? by Creexuls, a monster >:3 10/16/2008, 10:58pm PDT NEW
                                Re: The Enterprise is almost totally destroyed and a main character sacrifices t by laudablepuss 10/16/2008, 5:52pm PDT NEW
                                    You must not have if you don't see how Nemesis ripped off Wrath of Khan. by Creexuls, a monster >:3 10/16/2008, 6:18pm PDT NEW
                                        DS9 isn't Trek. It's a Babylon 5 ripoff. NT by Mischief Maker 10/16/2008, 6:27pm PDT NEW
                                            You watched Babylon 5? NT by Creexuls, a monster >:3 10/16/2008, 6:31pm PDT NEW
                                            Also DS9 is infinitely superior to Babylon 5 for AT LEAST one reason. by Creexuls, a monster >:3 10/16/2008, 6:53pm PDT NEW
                                                Worf NT by Fortinbras 10/16/2008, 8:56pm PDT NEW
                                                Re: Also DS9 is infinitely superior to Babylon 5 for AT LEAST one reason. by Cannibal Dave 10/16/2008, 11:05pm PDT NEW
                                                Also, Jake Sisco NT by Guy Desperately Trying to Fit In 10/16/2008, 11:18pm PDT NEW
                                                    Nog! NT by Fag 454 10/16/2008, 11:20pm PDT NEW
                                                        Post leg amputation. NT by Creexuls, a monster >:3 10/17/2008, 12:09am PDT NEW
                                        You sure are smart. by laudablepuss 10/16/2008, 6:54pm PDT NEW
                                            I just want to emphasize by laudablepuss 10/16/2008, 7:02pm PDT NEW
                                            Re: You sure are smart. by Creexuls, a monster >:3 10/16/2008, 7:04pm PDT NEW
                                                Re: You sure are smart. by laudablepuss 10/16/2008, 7:11pm PDT NEW
                                            Re: You sure are smart. by Ice Cream Jonsey 10/16/2008, 9:19pm PDT NEW
                                                Re: You sure are smart. by Creexuls, a monster >:3 10/16/2008, 9:34pm PDT NEW
                                                First Contact was horrible and you know it. by Mischief Maker 10/17/2008, 6:32am PDT NEW
                                                    I agree about the borg queen, and occasional cheesy moments. by Creexuls, a monster >:3 10/17/2008, 11:30am PDT NEW
                                                Here's a much simpler reason by FABIO 10/17/2008, 2:44pm PDT NEW
                                            When I got on the elevator, someone had already pushed the damn bridge button NT by Scotty 10/17/2008, 4:33pm PDT NEW
                                                We need a Caltrops ombudsman so I don't miss posts like this one NT by Ice Cream Jonsey 10/23/2008, 7:35pm PDT NEW
                                                    I agree, that's a good post. by Fussbett 10/23/2008, 9:37pm PDT NEW
                                                        DS9 never got bad, except for the Ferengi episodes, those pretty much sucked. NT by Creexuls, a monster >:3 10/23/2008, 9:44pm PDT NEW
                                        Goddamn, Creex. Goddamn NT by Souffle of Pain 04/08/2009, 8:28pm PDT NEW
                                Re: The Enterprise is almost totally destroyed and a main character sacrifices by FABIO 10/17/2008, 12:28am PDT NEW
                                    Re: The Enterprise is almost totally destroyed and a main character sacrifices by Creexuls, a monster >:3 10/17/2008, 12:50am PDT NEW
                The only single good part of the movie and of B4. by Creexuls, a monster >:3 10/16/2008, 4:16pm PDT NEW
                pictoral review of Nemisis that I happen to agree with by Weyoun Voidbringer 10/16/2008, 4:20pm PDT NEW
                    Did you sleep well? I did; I'm 12 hours closer to death! NT by Creexuls, a monster >:3 10/16/2008, 5:40pm PDT NEW
                    That pretty much sums up why it's objectively awful by FABIO 10/17/2008, 12:07am PDT NEW
                        yeah that's why I posted it >:( NT by Weyoun Voidbringer 10/18/2008, 10:19am PDT NEW
            Laudable, the ultimate troll? by Cannibal Dave 10/17/2008, 4:12pm PDT NEW
                Re: Laudable, the ultimate troll? by Creexuls, a monster >:3 10/17/2008, 4:16pm PDT NEW
                    Re: Laudable, the ultimate troll? by Mischief Maker 10/17/2008, 4:25pm PDT NEW
        My favorite is the one with the whales. :( NT by Fullofkittens 11/29/2008, 5:01pm PST NEW
            That's what my sister calls it. by Creexuls, a monster >:3 11/29/2008, 5:07pm PST NEW
    Are they trying to bring the Smallville treatment to another nerd franchise now? NT by FABIO 10/16/2008, 3:07pm PDT NEW
        Re: Are they trying to bring the Smallville treatment to another nerd franchise by laudablepuss 10/16/2008, 3:17pm PDT NEW
            Stupid apostrophe. :( NT by laudablepuss 10/16/2008, 3:17pm PDT NEW
            Meh. Focus on characters and story arcs are what killed the Trek franchise. NT by Mischief Maker 10/16/2008, 4:30pm PDT NEW
                No, Voyager and Enterprise and being on UPN killed Trek. NT by Horrible Gelatinous Blob 10/16/2008, 5:52pm PDT NEW
                    Pineapple cake killed Enterprise NT by Entropy Stew 10/18/2008, 2:56am PDT NEW
                        "The weapon" killed Enterprise by FABIO 10/18/2008, 2:54pm PDT NEW
                            There wasn't really any point in making Enterprise, period. by Creexuls, a monster >:3 10/18/2008, 3:37pm PDT NEW
                            You don't understand, it was an analogy for September the Eleventh. by Jerry Whorebach 10/18/2008, 3:57pm PDT NEW
            Also, Nosferatu builds an orbital laser beam to blow up Vulcan by Mischief Maker 11/26/2008, 7:26am PST NEW
    ok, I am interested and hopeful by Weyoun Voidbringer 10/16/2008, 4:25pm PDT NEW
        Re: ok, I am interested and hopeful by I need clarification 10/16/2008, 11:27pm PDT NEW
            Maybe slightly below average with some good parts. NT by Creexuls, a monster >:3 10/17/2008, 12:01am PDT NEW
    Next time, on a very special JJ Abrams Star trek (on the WB) NT by Fortinbras 10/16/2008, 8:51pm PDT NEW
    It's not like the original Chekov and Sulu needed the work... OH WAIT :( by Jerry Whorebach 10/18/2008, 2:12am PDT NEW
        You misunderstand, Doohan only fingered her. *BA DUMP PAASSSH* NT by Last 10/18/2008, 10:52am PDT NEW
    The new Enterprise is terrible. :( NT by laudablepuss 11/12/2008, 7:17pm PST NEW
        almost as terrible as the tos enterprise by Weyoun Voidbringer 11/12/2008, 9:09pm PST NEW
            TOS enterprise doesn't look enough like a cock for you? by Mischief Maker 11/18/2008, 8:09pm PST NEW
                That's . . . bizarre. Does somebody really think this? NT by laudablepuss 11/25/2008, 6:59pm PST NEW
    Nobody wants to weigh in on the new trailer? by motherfuckerfoodeater 11/18/2008, 3:54pm PST NEW
        I like how Nosferatu has a switchblade scepter. He's the bad guy, right? NT by Mischief Maker 11/18/2008, 4:40pm PST NEW
        The stuff exploding was neat. NT by laudablepuss 11/18/2008, 5:01pm PST NEW
        Tween Kirk was a retarded asshole? Cornfield shipyard? Otherwise, looks ok. NT by Last 11/18/2008, 5:16pm PST NEW
            The Apollo program was the final word on spaceship construction, apparently. NT by laudablepuss 11/18/2008, 6:26pm PST NEW
                Seaquest, Enterprise, and now JJ Abrams Star Trek all start with cornfields NT by Fortinbras 11/18/2008, 7:32pm PST NEW
        I wann be on the spaceship, dad! by FABIO 11/18/2008, 11:23pm PST NEW
            That story is easily as good as the Doom movie. NT by Creexuls, a monster >:3 11/18/2008, 11:56pm PST NEW
        Apparently the version I first saw was edited for vomit prevention. by Mischief Maker 11/25/2008, 6:53pm PST NEW
            Hey wanna play Thelma and Louise ha ha waaaaaaa look out look out look out look NT by Creexuls, a monster >:3 11/26/2008, 4:13am PST NEW
    So in anticipation, what's your vote for the all-time worst TOS episode? by Mischief Maker 11/23/2008, 8:25pm PST NEW
        The Halloween episode was pretty bad. NT by Jerry Whorebach 11/23/2008, 8:52pm PST NEW
        spocks brain and that other one by Weyoun Voidbringer 11/23/2008, 9:26pm PST NEW
            The Conscience of the King. Horrible. :( by laudablepuss 11/24/2008, 5:15pm PST NEW
                A ringa ding ding ding.......... ding. NT by Creexuls, a monster >:3 11/24/2008, 5:16pm PST NEW
                what halloween one? by Weyoun Voidbringer 11/24/2008, 5:18pm PST NEW
                    Re: what halloween one? by laudablepuss 11/24/2008, 5:54pm PST NEW
                        Re: what halloween one? by krd 11/24/2008, 8:05pm PST NEW
                            "The cat is the most ruthless, most terrifying of animals." NT by Spock 11/24/2008, 8:12pm PST NEW
    Early reviews are positive. by Last 04/08/2009, 9:18am PDT NEW
        Re: Early reviews are positive. by Souffle of Pain 04/08/2009, 8:31pm PDT NEW
    94% on Rotten Tomatoes with 109 reviews. NT by Last 05/07/2009, 11:51am PDT NEW
        Star Trek: First Contact - 91% GO SEE IT FOLKS NT by Fortinbras 05/08/2009, 9:17pm PDT NEW
            sometimes RT is right (then again they gave over 90% to michael moore's "films") NT by Weyoun Voidbringer 05/09/2009, 12:41am PDT NEW
 
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